Thinkpads Forum

Hi,

I was looking on these two laptops and for me, it looks like it is the same laptop just with different colour and screen (also the right hinge is different). It is well known that this laptop was created by Zenith Data Systems. But I have never seen some info about that if it was really designed or just "copy pasted".
After checking some pictures of motherboard and internals of the lower part of the laptop, it looks very similar. Does somebody know more about this topic? It can be nice to know that some parts are interchangeable. Or even build a FrankeNote

Check these two pictures:
https://imgur.com/a/Ws2sL1k

More pictures to compare:
https://imgur.com/a/ibm-ps-note-n45sl-6QG2lLN

vs.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/155620645677?m ... media=COPY

Yeah they're basically the same. Same power supply.

Somewhere I have an IBM laptop bag with both machines inside. And they're both rubbish.

Thank you.

solidpro wrote: ↑

Mon Sep 23, 2024 5:35 am

And they're both rubbish.

IBM engineers were not interested to design rubbish according to specifications from sales and marketing ... so they outsourced it

Yeah - for a while IBM seemed to be 'in bed' with Zenith. God knows why as most of what they made was very 'entry level', which didn't align with IBM's standards. Probably all because two men met in a golf club.

The 300 isn't really a thinkpad apart from the badge. It is a footnote and a dead end in the history books marketed as a consumer alternative to the 'business' 700. A bad choice as you could meet someone raving about the new thinkpad and end up with a 300, which would truly suck. The 310/315 was a fresh attempt years later but also not-IBM and awful (which has the same quirk as the 300 in that it has a rebadged brother - the Acernote Light 370PCX or similar), along with the 350 which was somewhere inbetween, based on a PS/Note design from Japan. Made 'by' IBM but with another dead-end design and terrible hinge design which means they're virtually all wrecked with generally bad screens and worse keyboards.

The 330 was also made 'FOR' IBM not by IBM and an odd design, closer to a RICOH design on the inside (if you ask me). It obviously has it's own story as if there was a battery available for it, I've never seen one. It's the only thinkpad I've seen without the need for an external PSU (although you could use one, if you wanted). It's also the only grey thinkpad not destined for Germany. Nobody knows why.

Of the 3xx series, The 340, 345, 360, 365, 370, 380, 385, 390 are the only true Thinkpads, with many of them having unique quirks and nice features and, with the exception of the hinge bases/plastics on the early 390 can be preserved to such a state they might live 'forever'.

It's interesting to (ps/)note that the 360,365,370,380,385,390 were released in chronological order, (with the 340 and 345 inserted randomly inbetween) whereas the 300, 310, 315, 330 and 350 were all randomly released outside of this chronology.

You can generally spot an imposter by the non-easy-setup BIOS.

Always thought the 310/315 was a shame as it's a pretty nice looking machine. But the keyboard is hideous and if you ever havd to take it apart, the plastics snap by just breathing near them.

Thank you for a very nice explanation. IBM tried really many dead ends before there were no more money/ideas/whatever to continue trying. But the variability/(backwards)compatibility and quirks are still amazing on "the real" ThinkPads. I miss that on modern laptops.

The Zenith version of the N45SL is known as the ZWL-0326. Based on the fact that the ZWL-0326 case is dark gray like the IBM version, I'd assume they were made in a short run by Zenith out of spare parts or something like that. All of Zenith's other laptops were beige. I'd agree that it was likely just a very lightly modified MastersPORT 386SL.

Also - people give the ThinkPad 300 too hard of a time. I have what's close enough to Zenith's version of it (Z-Note 425Lnc, the TP300 is a 325L or 325Lc for the 300C, of which my 425Lnc is just a 486 version of, same case), and it's a really nice and well-built machine. The issue with those is that they're absolutely full of leaky capacitors, so they take a bit of work to get running. That and the proprietary power plug. Anyways - it's a really underrated machine, and I'd love the dark gray IBM version, it looks really cool.

But that plastic and that screen...... makes me grimace.

The plastic on the Zenith version of the Tp300 is rock solid - is the dark gray version ultra-brittle or something?

astral wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 25, 2024 9:04 pm

The Zenith version of the N45SL is known as the ZWL-0326. Based on the fact that the ZWL-0326 case is dark gray like the IBM version, I'd assume they were made in a short run by Zenith out of spare parts or something like that. All of Zenith's other laptops were beige. I'd agree that it was likely just a very lightly modified MastersPORT 386SL.

I have checked some pics of that laptop and yes, it is missing floppy connector on the back side, and it has also that wide right hinge. All old ABS plastics are brittle. Those stored in dark, cold rooms are maybe better. I am wondering if it exists some way how to make them better. Dip them into something or spray something on top and let it "get into the plastic" to make it more flexible again.

It isn't that ALL abs plastics have gone brittle - most stuff from 1992 and earlier is still relatively fine. More brittle than it was than new, but not falling apart. Something changed around 1992/1993.

I don't really have a problem with brittleness on the 300, it's more that it's some kind of weird, quite harsh and 'cheap' feeling plastic that tends to wear because it has a top coat of a different colour.

That's definitely less of a problem on the beige Zenith version. Those can yellow though.

Wear of top coat is "universal" ThinkPad problem. Thinking about rubber coating. So maybe that was part of the order for Zenith - make bad topcoat But still - ThinkPad case with Zenith white/gray keys can be a special combination. And maybe even Zenith MB to have possibility for dual floppy drive.

That was my start with PCs - OS on one 360kb floppy in the first drive and everything else on the other 360kb floppy in the second drive. I still want to try how many floppy drives it is possible to connect at once to one ThinkPad. At least 3 pcs can be fine for unattended dos install