Which model for university studies and daily usage?

[Emulle]

Hello!

I need a a new laptop as my main computer for browsing, very light gaming(AoE II/HoMM III and the like, perhaps even some WoW whenever vanilla is re-released ), streaming 1080p DTS movies via my receiver and for my upcoming studies.
I'm currently using the ol' but trusty(& rusty!) 14.1" HP Compaq 6510b from my college days running on Debian, but to be frank it's not a Thinkpad. In other words it's not really that fun to play around with, and the lack of HDMI is a major problem, the performance also leaves a lot to be desired.

I've been eyeing the X230, which I find quite interesting with its small form factor and giant 9-cell battery. The dual hard drive capability and being able to install a IPS or FHD IPS screen is also quite eye-catching to say the least, no pun intended.

But... I'm also a little bit unsure regarding the screen size, considering it will be my daily driver and since I'm used to 14.1". I know that I will also need to have a lot of tabs & PDF-files open as well as Libreoffice Writer during study hours, so I am a bit uncertain if the screen real-estate will be enough with the 768p 12.5" screen.

Which brings me to the other model I'm finding interesting, the T440p, closer to the size of my Compaq. Perhaps a bit more future-proof but with a much larger footprint compared to X230. I would change the touchpad to the T450 iteration.

In either case, I plan on installing two drives, one bootable SSD and one HDD for storage as well as running Debian or Arch Linux and perhaps dual booting Windows 10.

Regarding the price of the two models I've found them both listed "as new" from the same company selling old office computers.

The X230 costs ~240€ with i5-3320M, 8gb ram, 180gb SSD, backlit keyboard & TN display.
The T440p costs ~560€(!) with i7-4700MQ(dGPU GT 730M), 8gb ram, 256gb SSD, backlit keyboard & FHD IPS screen.

So yea, I would really appreciate some help in choosing my next daily driver for the next 5 years or so!

Cheers,
Emil

Update: By the way, I ordered a T440p for about $240 in "like new" condition(we'll see when it turns up if the pictures are just) with the following specs:
i5-4300m, 8gb, 180gb ssd, backlit keyboard and the 1600x900 display.

[RealBlackStuff]

Welcome to the Forum.

I have both and it's hard to say which one I prefer.

My X230 had the IPS FHD-mod and the X220 keyboard.
But I have swapped the FHD back to an IPS HD LCD and went back to a non-backlit X230 keyboard.
It runs W7 off an mSATA SSD in the WWAN-slot and has a 500GB HDD in the main bay for storage.
That HDD powers off after a few minutes of non-activity.

My T440p with Intel gfx has IPS FHD and will keep that, it's perfect for my needs.
I replaced the Clunkpad with a T450 touchpad+buttons.
Currently it has a 2.5" SSD with W7, but I plan to install an M.2 SSD in the WWAN-slot and put a large HDD or SSD in the main bay.
If needed I have an Ultrabay adapter for a third 2,5" drive and I also have a few external USB CD/DVD drives.

So far the X230 sees more action, but that might soon change.
I like both machines and couldn't really tell you which one I prefer.
Both can run with 16GB RAM.
The T440p has a newer CPU and GPU than the X230, plus it has better battery life.
If 14" is your preference, then definitely the T440p.
If smaller size and less weight, then the X230.

[Emulle]

Hey, thanks!

Well, the thing is I don't really know which screen size I prefer, considering I've only owned laptops that have had 14.1" displays.
So jumping to a 12.5" could be a bliss or a complete miss. I must say though that I have considered a Macbook Pro 13" 2015 model, and the size different is not that big.

I've searched around a bit and it seems that the T440p(especially with the dGPU) are known to have problems with Linux, that might be a problem because that will be my to-go OS. Even though the T440p is a much more powerful computer I don't think that I will make use of it. I rarely, if ever edit photos, and if I do I use Lightroom Mobile on my Android phone.
The HD 4000 in the X230 is more than capable to drive the old, and low power-hungry game that I'm interested in.
The X230 is also favorable because of the price, I have done some research and I don't think I will reach 550€ even with all the upgrades I'm planning for the X230.


Can I ask why you reverted to the standard keyboard & HD IPS? You say that you get longer battery life on the T440p, which battery packs do you have for both, and what is your average battery life for both?

[Cigarguy]

Small screen size devices are nice for mobility but if I'm staring at a screen for a long time or often each day I want the nicest screen in the biggest size that I can afford. At work for example, were are given a nice HP Windows 10 tablet with a nice screen but only 2% of the time will I use the tablet's screen. 98% of the time it's hooked up to a docking station with 2 1920p IPS screens. Only time I use the tablet's screen is for a quick meeting away from my desk.

[MikalE]

Same here. That's why I like my T500 so much. I love my other Thinkpads too, but they can't beat the aspect ratio of the T500 screen. In fact, it is what I'm using right now.

I have a 10" Lenovo Windows tablet, but it's just used for quick forum checks and email.

I have never considered a 14" Thinkpad.

[RealBlackStuff]

Can I ask why you reverted to the standard keyboard & HD IPS? You say that you get longer battery life on the T440p, which battery packs do you have for both, and what is your average battery life for both?

I went back to HD because my eyes are not what they used to be.
And I removed the (US) X220 keyboard when I found a perfect (UK) X230 keyboard, because I grew up with and prefer UK-layout.

My 6-cell X230 battery lasts about 4 hours, the 6-cell T440p about 3.5 hours.
Both are rather heavily used batterieswith many cycles.

[Emulle]

Can I ask why you reverted to the standard keyboard & HD IPS? You say that you get longer battery life on the T440p, which battery packs do you have for both, and what is your average battery life for both?

I went back to HD because my eyes are not what they used to be.
And I removed the (US) X220 keyboard when I found a perfect (UK) X230 keyboard, because I grew up with and prefer UK-layout.

My 6-cell X230 battery lasts about 4 hours, the 6-cell T440p about 3.5 hours.
Both are rather heavily used batterieswith many cycles.

Oh I see.
How are you liking the X230 keys in contrast to the "classic" keys of the X220?

[RealBlackStuff]

Even though I was a programmer in a previous life, I still only type with 2 fingers.
The X230 keys are a little bit bigger than the X220 ones, perfect for me.
I have a non-backlit LiteOn KB, which is less 'smudgy' than the backlit ones.
Plus my X230 is the last of the Mohicans with a ThinkLight.

[Emulle]

Oh I see.

Do you know if it's possible to do a classic keyboard swap on the T440p?

[axur-delmeria]

Oh I see.

Do you know if it's possible to do a classic keyboard swap on the T440p?

Not possible.

[Emulle]

Alright, no worries I do quite fancy the back-lit keyboard.

I'm seeing a lot of positive reports of Unix based OS on the X230, but much less on the T440p, is there any user here which primarily use the T440p with Unix?

Also, do both of the computers support high bitrate 1080p bluray rips with DTS sound via the displayport?

If the m2-sata is set as bootable drive is it possible to have both the internal SATA-HDD and ultrabay-HDD to spin down after x amount of minutes as on the X230?

[RealBlackStuff]

You can tell all HDDs to spin down after a period of non-use.
With an SSD that's not needed.

[Emulle]

Okay that's nice, thought it was only possible with the internal SSD, altough I guess the ultrabay HDD should show up as an internal HDD in BIOS.

By the way, I ordered a T440p for about $240 in "like new" condition(we'll see when it turns up if the pictures are just) with the following specs:
i5-4300m, 8gb, 180gb ssd, backlit keyboard and the 1600x900 display.

I slept on it and came to my senses that the x230 will probably not be enough concerning multitasking with the small screen.
I also quite like the idea of the upgrades available for the T440p, first off will of course be the T450 trackpad, then we will see how bad the battery and screen is.

Thanks for your help, see you around the T440 parts of the forum!


Emil

[RealBlackStuff]

To swap that clunkpad, see here: viewtopic.php?f=68&t=126860

[Emulle]

To swap that clunkpad, see here: viewtopic.php?f=68&t=126860

Thank you! Now to find a reputable seller of a T450 touchpad within EU.

Does it really matter if I buy a Synaptics or Alps trackpad since there are drivers available for both, and that I will use Linux?

[RealBlackStuff]

If you only want the buttons and don't care for the touchpad (like me), then either is fine.
But those who also use the touchpad (with Windows), prefer Synaptics.
Don't know what Linux users prefer, or how good/bad its drivers are.

[Emulle]

If you only want the buttons and don't care for the touchpad (like me), then either is fine.
But those who also use the touchpad (with Windows), prefer Synaptics.
Don't know what Linux users prefer, or how good/bad its drivers are.

Alright, cheers!

I read somewhere that people complained about choppy 2-finger scrolling on the Alps, I hope it's a driver issue and not that the hardware is inferior to that of the Synaptics.

The Alps one is much easier to find(and cheaper) in EU.

[Omineca]

I'm seeing a lot of positive reports of Unix based OS on the X230, but much less on the T440p, is there any user here which primarily use the T440p with Unix?

The T440p will be great with Linux. I have an L440, which is really the low-end equivalent of the T440p (same generation and the CPU, screen, RAM, hard drive, clunkpad, etc., are similarly upgradeable) and it runs Debian without a hitch.

My setup notes are here: viewtopic.php?p=837661#p837661

If you use a desktop that's more advanced than LXDE you probably wouldn't need all of the manual tweaks.

[WinksLol]

Hey there! I was a student once you know, so I would say a MacBook is your best choice. Before you say anything, just here me out. MacBooks are super light and thin so you can carry them with you easily. I used a 13 inches one and I loved it! Oh besides, the interface is easy enough to navigate. Not to mention that it’s very pretty.